the blocking & tackling of finding a job in 90 days w/ lawrence lockhart

full transcript

auto-generated from the audio, so expect a few typos. the audio is the source of truth.

All right, so part one, I don't want to hit on it too much because you can go watch it on my YouTube And the way LinkedIn I put a tweet out this morning I don't know what happened with LinkedIn, but we need to reset it because I'm seeing posts from three to four weeks ago I saw you too. Yeah, yeah It's crazy my timeline But again, that's why you should post LinkedIn because I think LinkedIn has a really good job of like repurposing old content But you can check this out basically Lawrence give a quick rundown of what like part one was Part one was Lawrence was enjoying himself having a fantastic time as a developer Abigail a company called bought it a company that I still love to respect by the way They have good products.

He's great people and in January they would throw a reorg or restructuring in I was one of me We're laid off I did not see coming I was literally planning for an overseas trip Like you know what cancer that played ticket we should have talked a bit and so that took me into kind of a tizzy Didn't see that coming but I was really really methodical and strategic about getting that process processed right And getting it down on paper and coming up with a strategy and so part one of this interview was about going from that point To rehired at a new job in a company called be free.

We are the go-to solution for corporate email enterprise email sales email We are email. We're yeah, so be free got me on board. I'm seeing developed advocate there And the big win was the fact that I set a goal for myself I had a time goal a smart goal the tea is time based right So I had a smart goal of getting rehired at 90 days and I actually started a day 89 I'm a new job so there you go nine two Every March April April eight I got started or no. Yeah, everybody Been there a month three days or not be there a month crazy crazy also to Chris.

It's all my LinkedIn I mean YouTube YouTube so if you go to my YouTube channel, I have all my conversations on there So yeah, definitely check that out. All right, so Yeah, actually so fine. I was texting one of my buddies Actually, I actually go to church with and he was stalking my LinkedIn today and I sent it in our like Wives group chat and he was like you Post all the time because it's impressive. I was like what was my job so But all right, so Yeah, yeah, yeah, so I think so the again part one we talked about just what you did You cold applied you wanted your brain to proceed you so again Please check that out But I'm interested I'm always curious about like what the day-to-day look like right like How do you structure your day with being laid off?

You said you waited a week You know before getting going again check out that interview But like once you started going like what did your day consist of Yeah, so I want you to something really weird. I'm gonna start with the punchline. Please have a kiwi interview I love it The main message on one people to pull out of this entire talk whether it's 15 minutes 30 minutes whatever is Please invest time and learning who the heck you are This that's my that's my salient message I'm gonna say that stronger than everything else because I'm gonna give some tips I'm gonna answer your question directly how I share all that stuff But I don't want people to walk away and think that that is the answer The reason I implemented that is because I know how I work and I know how I work from paying attention to what has happened in the Mid-e Taylor.

Oh my god the many failures. I've had in life Things just not going right at all Think that you never put on Twitter or Instagram because you don't want nobody to know Yes, there is but I paid attention That's why I want people to do a lot more find to ask for advice find the list in the folks like us get information from podcast At the end of the day know who you are how you operate where your energy levels are because if I say my energy levels are high at 6 a.m And yours are at 8 p.m But you don't know that yet and you go over doing the 6 a.m.

thing or 5 a.m. thing for 90 days You think there's something wrong with me. There's nothing wrong with you You need to figure out where are yours the idea is not too copy me It's you discover you and to figure out one of the fundamental principles that I can apply in my life That being said I Know me and I know if I don't stay busy I will go into a formal slump Same been after my divorce from my first wife. Yep Happened after the only time I was actually terminated from a job which was at God Ryan's steakhouse way back in the day Also tied them to that divorce scenario and I just did nothing and I went into the worst slump Taylor I was a bum a bum a bum would be Embarrassed me.

I was doing nothing because I wasn't doing anything. I am wire I have to be productive. My time we re-random things I have to be productive So as you mentioned once I got the layoff first week I didn't do anything other than all the emotions out the crying the praying Researching myself and write about days six or seven. I really sat down and mapped out What do my days need to look like me to stay in good spirits to go through this process and be able to have the right middle attitude? Be able to show up at the best of me in every interview We talked about this in the last one.

You don't want to show up like a beggar or a girl like your desperate You want to show up confident which you can offer the company. Yeah, I need to structure my day And I knew I need to hit a few key points. I need to do something for my body Something for my spirit Something for my brain Hmm something for my family Those were the four and so it was so simple It was not complex to what he needs to buy like a 90 page book on how to structure your life I knew those four were critical something for my family something for my brain something for my spirit So people my body and so on Google Calendar Google Calendar.

Oh, I mean, I even know should I've tried notion So many times it doesn't work for me Nobody having YouTube videos. I watch for how many people sing its praises notion doesn't work for me But Google Calendar does particularly when I put in reminders Yeah, me on my phone and I simply put in the time to this is a particularly work-of-home And I'm just oh I'm not working at all and nobody's here I put in the time where I wanted to make sure I worked out every day The time where I was going to pray and have devotion the time where I was going to Read or code Also the time so this wasn't a requirement But I had to do it to get another job the time of going to either research companies or apply and Family time was in like every evening five days a week Five days a week that was a system It became so rigorous after like two weeks I was kind of proud of myself.

I started posting them out of like by the way Here's my calendar people like oh wow it's so stretchy so amazing. Oh, yeah, this is really not amazing See, I don't believe I've never believed in this people have asked me this in like Twitter spaces and Mentorships how do you achieve work-life balance? I think maybe it's just a bit snowwork, but I've never ever ever believed in balance between work and life I believe in getting the things done that are important to me Whatever's important to me get it done and the way that I get it led to put it on a calendar put it on a schedule Put it on Gcal put it on my white work put it down somewhere that's visual because Only I'm very Santa log and very kidding Where put a reminder on it and then just get it done and if I put the things out of the most important to me on my calendar I'm not going to miss.

No, I'm not going to miss if it's out of sight of the mind The week pass in my wife's like hey, babe, did you pay so itself? Oh shoot It wasn't on account of it right in right it down Same way that happens. Oh, man. I'm so forget about things. I know that I know I forget for right for all the praises I see of myself. I'm very forgetful same horrible memory So that's not if they just complain about do something about it right? I know I don't forget for therefore Something I want to get done write it down write it down. I'm still an analog person all day long Put it on you calendar put it on my whiteboard put it somewhere where I will see it because possible drop a reminder on it and then I get it done That's the answer enter the podcast.

You're having that's day. Yeah Also want to go shot to Elliott. He just landed a job as well 38 days unemployed He texted me last week, so congrats to him and That's my Christian brother down in Jack's Mississippi. I met him at the original the first ever Magnolia J Yep Magnolia J asks I love a place I met our sour Justin Samuels for renders for Before there was a render he has spoken to me at million Js shut off to Elliott super happy about him I'm trying to get him on on a video to interview him too. I love it. I love it. Oh, yeah I want to be a son of my name's um, all right, so I it be your own so so what So like what worked like how did you balance so you were applying?

You were you were mass applying Obviously the conversations you have from a supply huh? Oh, it's not massive or cold cold applying yes cold Yeah, yeah Yeah, yeah, we put a frequency dead if I'm coming back to you because mass applying is random and yes Yes, okay, that makes sense. Yeah Bro numbers in your favor and you don't even care. I did right I never did that every single company every single application. I put in was super targeted I do the companies under the teams and the products. I do I would be a good fit And do I had qualities that made me highly competitive?

I don't care who they had as a candidate pool those companies and I also do every company I applied for was first of class And what they did sure apply for any bunk companies regardless of the size they had to be the best And that's why at 89 days always submitted 47 applications You know, I think that's a small number, but if every single company is tailored in every single resume It's tailored that I did a cover letter for every single one that offered it That's a good number. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Okay. Great. I'm actually glad you I'm glad you correct me on that because I like that a lot so Like so first off obviously time block the stuff is important to you get outside going to work out Have quite time family time so first off like that's what you started so time block the calendar on those like five areas and then What did your were your mornings?

Crafting your CV and your resume and applying and then the afternoons were interviews Like what what did that look like? Yes, mine was and I could pull it up probably but mine was obviously for every morning I get my daughter off So I'll three kids my teen daughters till here. I'll take care of her breakfast and lunch every morning But I just yeah, the standard thing get her done checking my wife. She's next you need help with lunch Be this be that get her out. What's your going? That's what I start okay? Parent devotion every morning sure and everything we get it got to go on our phone from our church So I really love that very time do that.

I haven't cleaned up myself yet So it's a great time to work out. I'll grab the weights You can't do the weightly to grab the weights or the Oculus or I'll go out and garden gardening is amazing workout It is my can confirm You're outside a lot of work breaking ground for the first time That's like old-man street work so I'm a little warning while I haven't cleaned up yet now I've done all that kind of stuff jump in do a good routine get myself together feeling good for on real clothes Because I want to be on the mindset like I'm an active professional not a bum So I put on real clothes every day get online and I'm gonna go to it either researching companies or applying to whether they're Art or research for adjusting resume adding a little something to a LinkedIn adding a little content out there to make sure my Brand is being continuously refed Kind of like you mentioned your feed like LinkedIn was a little lagging one make sure people's feed of me Was not a little lagging so putting out little content little nuggets of wisdom that are Tectylated are professional but continue to extend my brand hate even though I'm not employed.

I still know things I'm still a valuable guy, so that would be kind of mid afternoon break for lunch I would take an actual break for lunch in a separate room that I come back here because this is one of two things Just talk about that talk talk about that talk about that Yeah, well just get now Yeah, oh, no, I wouldn't leave the house. I would just go to another room. Oh, no, no I just might get out of your office. Yes, so that's important because I need that mental break I need I need that mental shift I believe in neural associations about everyone does that's fine But I believe in neural associations that feeds you to consistently enough your brain will begin to attach me to them So I come in here.

I'm getting something done. This room right here is getting something done It might be something like that working out. It might be working personally on my personal computer Obviously, I'm on my work computer now, but this is the getting something done room when I go out of here Yeah, my tempo slows My cardiovascular slows. I'm not yelling at people on the mic And so I can digest my food better Put on some YouTube and not have lunch and sit on and have an hour lunch And then I come back here and then I hit it again Yeah, I like that mode and then four o'clock You know your start is back home.

It's back in the family time typically from like four to eight four to nine So let me ask you this Workday out of every day. I was unemployed every day. Yeah, no, no, no I think you should I mean and I think that's the best thing I want to highlight which you've done and I want to continue to drive home I mean you have to approach the job search like it's a job like Like like if you just wake up in your pajamas and your bathrobe and You're like Uncle Bob and brands on bathrobes, which is wild And you're just out here sending DMs Willie nilly And hoping it's gonna work.

It's not gonna work like you have to approach it from a day Like just from a a grind perspective. Let me ask you this I am curious I'm sorry, please yeah, go ahead. Yeah, no, you're the guest What you just said is so spot on we just had a person on the hunt to a space Saturday And they were asking for help with their CV Okay, because they are in a place where they do CV is not resumes and when I came my time speak I said how do you know what's your CV is problem? I mean, I'm asking some open-ended questions and digging it found out number one.

They were randomly applying I said you can't do that. Yeah, it's not a big teaching Yeah, there was something else that they weren't doing right ahead. Let's do the CV. I said let me help you you're an engineer So here and as an engineer your job is not about the code. It's about solving problems Hopefully you have a methodology a system about how you solve problems of any type Finding a bug there's a network issue an database issue. You have a system of how you solve problems Here's your first engineering problem. How to get higher? I need you to get a pencil and paper a Google Doc I will spread sheet out care get something and get a system get a strategy that you're gonna follow That doesn't mean it's gonna work but you have a system that's giving you results That's data that you can learn from because the next thing is you track everything where you apply when you apply the interview process Everything I did I track I got into this spreadsheet.

It's still there. I did this Seven plus years ago. I got my very first take job. I did it this last three months every place I applied every rejection email every interview Everything is in a sheet and you can never be just copy that spreadsheet For within an L.O.M. and get all the data analysis you want like hey these companies hated your resume or what you Whatever you want to extract right that you figure out your thing, but you've got data So the point is don't do random things when you need to get a job That is a problem to solve and you should use your engineering brain to figure out what system what flowchart can I put together?

That's a series of steps Likely to at least get me a call and this young lady unfortunately wasn't even getting calls so that's like step zero Yeah, right and so maybe it was CV, but maybe not. How do you know where you're applying even higher people where you live? What data are you working on? What is your strategy? Please get a strategy and so the thing that I did is not necessarily the best thing It was just my strategy the places where I applied there are places interesting to me It's where I felt like my unique skill set my maturity the life experience I have in business before tech all those things combined With my brand with my networking with my public presence, but maybe a strong candidate now I had placed in that reject it me Quickly place that rejected me in a week.

I had a rejection just last a week for like two months ago So I'll inject it from tons of places. Yeah, it's not about the rejections you have to do this That's just dust. It's about getting that one to give you a chance. Yeah, they're freaking kill it Absolutely did I How did you balance not over researching because I feel like and Correct me if I'm wrong. I feel like in the engineering mindset is deep research trying to really Figure that out and I feel like some folks can over research stuff right? You're researching the jobs you're researching companies you know how did you balance the research versus the Hey, sometimes we just got let it rip and move on right?

um I think I had a simple system I didn't probably again. I want to really emphasize for anyone listening I didn't do anything fancy in this process Nothing highfalutin nothing that would take like reading some 90-day book I just would research a company Make some assessment space of what I was looking for. Are they the best in classes? I acknowledge I'm interested in do they seem like they have some growth? I would copy information from their website Dropping into Gemini because I'm team Gemini on everything for whatever reason ask it some questions and then ask it to do Deep research so Gemini has a thing called deep research I would ask it to go into deep research He give you some financial information about the company and their strength and probable growth like all that stuff And if I like what I saw I would apply Very fine 89 days only applied to 47 places.

That's almost like one every two days. Yeah And I think that would freak some people out That's awesome because when I applied I was applying with confidence sure place I like and I think they'll likely So if I did the research on Monday I might apply to that one place on Tuesday Yeah, you know if I did the next six in the finish of day to a research on that I might apply to one on Wednesday or Thursday It wasn't a whole lot of applying and so that was I guess related to the balance But again, I don't think it turns to balance when I say balance from mathematical mindset I think six in one hand have doesn't it another things balance.

I wasn't bouncing anything I was just digging into a company until I find what I was looking for and then applying and that Average out to be about one every two days give or take maybe one My problem five days, but that wasn't a plan. I got my own reply once every two days. I just want to research 20 times I did not find out I'll put you for you was a big popular companies that had openings I was research because I'm in a lot of networking groups that would post job about their real all time Yeah, I'm like oh we sighted. I would look up like They don't stay make that very good at what they do or I'm not liking the profile of this one like there was a lot that I were jayking for you put in the application Cross one that was intrigued.

I would dig deeper about saw what I was looking for and it felt like I would be a good fit At least to me than I would apply That makes sense. All right in the mini cases. I would trade to our resume up because again I would throw my resume and throw my JD into Gemini Now say give me a round five version of the following resume that better suits this Be sure not to add any skills and not mention in the resume It's out a master resume that way too long It's like three three pages long and I have it to condense it down.

Oh, I like that one page resume The three has everything I can do, but I can do is not relevant for every position So I have condensed the big resume down to a small company use AI to do that Absolutely that's smart now after smart I read it top to bottom and make sure everything on there Yes, everything on there. I can pass everything on there It was a word that I would naturally use in conversation Everything there sounds like my tone. It's not my point to that But it is me and it's done very very quickly because I use AI for it. Love that love that No, it comes out has a great conversation question here Lawrence How did you go about follow-up?

Like if you hadn't heard back in one of two weeks. I think this is this is such a I think that most people struggle with Tell my follow-up with companies Okay, so again, I can only share my experience. I never followed up Screeze Again, and I know everybody hadn't seen part one part one was I'm just going to apply and the strength of my brand is all I need I don't need to follow up with anybody check with anybody I'm not gonna pull on my network That's enough. That was a 90-day test Have the 90-day 90-day test not passed Right now. I was still unemployed today.

We'll be doing all of this stuff I'll be doing the follow-up. I'll be calling friends. I'll be on torque. I will be everywhere I didn't even ask you I didn't because that's my network. That's my people and that's like an ask I want to kind of keep that in the kid. That was like my emergency foot My network with my emergency foot follow-up with people and pursuing them and getting in their DMs That was my emergency fun. I know I could do it But I was testing myself even while unemployed to see has all the stuff I've been teaching people about brand management for seven years have I actually done it or I've actually been going to smoke up my own But Do I have a brand where people can look more in name of online as a dev rel and see a body of work that proves the resume is accurate And my case it came out to be true, but it could be on the other way if it not I would have definitely followed up Time wise But then again, you know many times you're applying to you know just a system and not a person So I had to think about that one honestly answer yeah, but in my case I didn't follow up a single single company not what's crazy Also Noah great shirt on your profile little torque shirt.

Love it. Love it. Love it Here's this is curious. Did you send a thank you is a thank you email considered follow-up? I had a few That sent for interviews Not applications, but yes, I did a few thankings for interviews You ever follow up with the interviewer on LinkedIn? I talk about a lot like and just send them a quick note when you connect with them After the interview like hey, thanks for chatting. Hope talk to you soon. Did you join that? There you go, there you go. Good things to do. I just don't want to miss represent history. Sure all these smart things I just didn't do I was really really just cold cut and dry about what I did and I felt good in my little process As a test had I not always seen people are asking would be definitely yes It's because they're just smart and their good relationship management above and beyond and a bit individual job Yep, in my case not a single one.

Yeah, and again Thank you for interviews though. Yeah, and I want to reiterate I mean the Lord the reason why I'm interviewing Lawrence on part two I mean his strategy was very very different and that's why I said go please watch Episode one of my YouTube Because it is a different approach And I wouldn't say it works all across the board, but it's this is fascinating enough where you could pull in a lot of Yeah This crap I'm talking about right yeah, that's why I'm saying yeah, I hope I'm brand I wasn't seeing your anything no one knew me so I was going for all the jobs I'm sending all the fake use and all the follow-up and begging everybody I knew because I was in a different place in life Yeah, I was very very interested in testing Did Lawrence do a successful job in building a brand that speaks for itself Now did I know while I'm a set time did you try to do interviews in the morning in the afternoon?

It's like when do you work best with interviews? I'm curious with that everything scheduled them because my day is free. I didn't um, sure. I didn't try to manage that in any particular way Um Good question though good question. I'm not sure if that would have been a strategic thing to try or not But if they said to 30 am for them, I'm like good. I'm there. Yeah, I'm just structured my day to think hey Thursday 2 30 it's time to be on coffee at 1 30 out of rain at 2 o'clock. Yeah I had a stack. Yeah, no, I love it. It's come true up Because I remember interviewing before I ended up at torque.

I had three interviews in one in one afternoon and I mean I was not was awful like I think Yeah, it was good. Yeah, so again. I space space. I mean, did you ever have more than one interview today? No, not at the time We had like three of the week but never in a day sure yeah Because because I show up kind of like this and this is this kind of experience a lot of energy for me Oh, it does. Oh, it does. I work harder to do one of these after this. Yes. I wouldn't get this guy right Now I'll yeah, I know listen to my chance of getting another callback.

Correct. I want to pay some 100% more into whatever I am Yeah, 100% more in every single time they feel the energy they build a passion when I say I want to work for you Because I can do these things. I'm believable. I live here in my eyes on the camera. They're like, I believe yeah I mean, I'm looking at you guys right now a lot of eye contact. Yeah, I love it. I love it. Ah Man, it's great. Anything else man as we wrap up Man definitely have to plug my company be free Yeah, go to for email fascinating that we had over a half a million people use us to make emails within the last year and Many of those were through our app, which is very popular drag and drop but also meeting we're through our white labeled SDK That's the part where I come in the software development kit where you can embed our software into your existing platform and have the power of be free It's an amazing team.

Massmark CEO. Awesome guy. My boss actually also guy's a map of my teammate love her We've got Mike Nelson from RGE really got email team for God of email. He's on the team. It's an amazing company So everyone check out be free and definitely go check out Taylor and toward all that they're doing I love that community and the community based approach to candidates and getting candidates on board it. Yep That really unique Yep, awesome sweet. All right y'all. Well again, thank y'all so much for hanging out Lauren stay on second say body back stage But y'all have a great one busy week this week.

So I am off tomorrow I'm podcast actually was some on her podcast Tomorrow morning Wednesday's busy. We have our boy Francesco Coming on the pod and then I'll be on Angelo's first podcast on called the job decoder Basically talking about all things in the tech industry non software development that you can get involved with and then Our boy James quick Thursday is coming on the show Yeah, yeah, this time 930 so Yeah, so so 930 on Thursday on point James quick out of not retirement He's working, but I would say like online retirement. So it's gonna be a good one. So I'll be there. Yeah, yeah Y'all have a good one.

Appreciate y'all love y'all see y'all see y'all on the discord boost Hey, you did it you listened to an entire episode and I am very grateful because you know why there's a lot of podcasts out there There's a lot of episodes and I myself rarely finish an entire episode So I appreciate you so so much for listening quick reminder Please rate and review this podcast in the app store I want this to be discoverable to others and the only way that happens is if you take the time right now and rate and review it Please like right now Unless you're driving and don't do it.

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